engine installation

[thatbigbody]

A local engine shop wants $1000 for an engine install if i bring them an engine I want put in, same type of engine, unmodified. $1000?!? Does this seem reasonable. For a shop that takes engines out fixes em, or gets new ones and puts them back in all day long, this seems ridiculous to me. At about $60 an hour labour, he basically would be charging me for like 17 hours of work! That's ridiculous. Seems like it can be done in just several hours. What is the big frickin deal about a factory engine swap anyway? Is it really that complicated? It is not worth a G to me and I really want to do it myself just so that shop can kiss my ass. Anybody with any experience want to give me some details. I could really use a write up or something. I've searched all over trhe net and I think it is probably just too basic of knowledge for anyone to take time write it up

[fishdude84]

well 60$/ an hour sound like alot. and yes 17 hours sounds about right for time it takes put in a new motor. Have you ever looked at all those hoses and wires and shit all under your hood? thats alot of shit to disconnect from the old motor and contect the new one. and also do they have to unbolt the trannie or is it coming out too? thats another issue. putting an engine back in a car is a long painstaking process especially on a new car with all the electronic fuel injected shit under the hood, and cable and wires and what not. you really have to think about how much work it is. then the big question is this. When they are done installing it, and that crap is hooked up, will the darn thing start up and go? Also why do you want to change your engine out? the only reasons for changing an engine would be if its blown and dosent work or you want a bigger one for the extra horsepower. if the engine in the car works fine and the car drives well, and there are not any major mechanical problems, then i would not replace the engine.

Alex

[thatbigbody]

Well yes you do have a point. There is alot of stuff to diconnect. but 17 hrs still seems like alot to me for people that do this all day and all night. Maybe $60 an hour is alot, I don't know exactly how much thes guys make, but if it's less than that then the price seems even more unreasonable. The tranny will be staying in seeing as how it was recently rebuilt and the reason the engine is coming out is because it has a rod knock aka bad rod bearing, which as you probably know means emminent death of the engine. So in order to prepare for the worst I must make preparations now and do my homework. Another guy told me it's probably better to deal with it now than to wait until the piston decides to exit the side of the block while I'm doin 80 or some dumb shit. I have to agree.

[fishdude84]

well, if you want to save money, i would go rent an engine lift somewhere, and spend the weekend trying to pull the old motor out, and have the car towed somewhere and let THEM drop the new one in. if you want to do this though, keep in mind it WILL take you a few days to pull the old engine out, but will prob save you some money. also get a few buddies out with you to help, that will make it more fun and easier on you.

[LM13]

you might want to pull the tranny out along with the engine, easier that way. then just move the tranny over to the new engine. you'll probably end up taking the hood off as well.
i hope feliks will chime in here, coz i somewhat helped him with his engine swap, but i all i remember is that he pulled the tranny along with the engine, and had to take either the hood or the radiator support off, hood was easier to take off so he did that.
hth
good luck

[capriceman]

For a garage with the equipment, who specializes in engine swaps, 17 hours is way to long.
45 min. to disconnect wire harnes's, 20,(I'm being liberal here), for the fuel line, 10 for the radiator.
Let's be nice and give them 30 min. to disconnect the transmission, that's an hour and 45 min. Give 'em another 20 for vacume lines, battery, take a wiz.
The engine's ready to be pulled.
Lift the car a few feet, hook up the hoist, 45 min.-1 hour.
Loosen the mounting bolts, put tension on the hoist, remove bolts, lift engine. 3hr. 50 min.
Have lunch.
Install, reverse.
That should be adequete times for a shop that does this as thier main thing.
A grand is too much.
$500 is reasonable.
I did a direct swap in my driveway in a day and a half. The only special tool that I rented was the hoist.
I brought a fuel line disconnect tool, ended up useing a pair of pliers.
Check around some more.
If they tell you, "Well there's more to it than that." Ask them what.

[fishdude84]

how much would a 80-90K used LT1 engine cost. maybe i swap my L99 for and LT1

[Incitatus]

I don't think I'd pull the tranny with the motor. I used to do that way back when... (would you believe in the late 70's?)
Back then I used a come-along or chain hoist -it can withstand the additional weight and has a greater range.
A hydraulic hoist, on the other hand, is limited to weight and range. This makes pulling the additional weight and length of the transmission that much more difficult.
I found that out a couple of years ago.
Either block up the transmission from the ground or wedge something between the tail shaft and floor pan (or both). I realize the bellhousing bolts are harder to get to like that, but...


-For what it's worth-

[thatbigbody]

Thanks for all the advice fellas. 500 sounds alot more reasonable so I think I will have to keep looking. I wish I had the experience to do it myself or knew someone. I'd probably pay someone just to supervise me doing it cause it doesn't really seem that hard just disconecting and reconnecting a bunch of stuff. 100 bucks -any takers?:D Any one of you experienced guys think you might be able to e-mail me a procedure. I know it seems alot less complicated once you've done it before. I supervised my friends replacing brakes and rotors and other simple things cause it seems just so much easier once youve gone through it before.

[capriceman]

Get Yourself a Haynes manual. Or even better if You can find one, a factory repair manual.
I've pretty much always used Haynes.
The procedure for engine removal is spelled out step by step.
Just take Your time, follow the book, be carefull.
One very important thing I've learned the hard way more that once.
DON'T TAKE SHORT CUTS!
Every time I end up going back and doing it over the right way any how.
Take Your time. Dedicate three days to it.
You'll probibly get it in two, but give Yourself that extra time.
Double check and make sure that You have every thing You'll need before starting.
Good luck.
Have fun with it.

[Incitatus]

Something that I used to do when I disassembled stuff was to take Polaroids of it before I started.
Maybe you can use one of those disposable cameras.
Take as many pictures as possible, from as many different angles as possible
(paying close attention to wiring and vacuum hoses), then take it to a one hour photo. Go get lunch and any last minute supplies from the parts house, pick up your pictures and Go For It!
Always replace your motor mounts and transmission mount regardless if they look good or not -it's just too damn easy to change them now as oppossed to a couple of months later...

I'd be willing to help you, but I live in Houston.

Oh, one more thing, see if you can find wiring labels -or use thin masking tape and write on it where the wire or hose went. Color code them if you have to.
(Just be careful not to accidentally knock them off when pulling the motor).

Good Luck!

[fishdude84]

use a digital camera instead if you have one

[capriceman]

Camera's an excellent idea. So is changing engine mounts.
When You get the new engine, if used go ahead and replace the gaskets wile it's out of the car.
Oil pan and main seal gasket a must. It is about 1.2 billion times eaiser to replace the main with the engine hanging from a hoist.
One thing I wanted to mention.
If You have someone do this for You, it'll work, You'll have a new engine.
If You do it Your'self, You'll be ten times as proud.